Charge/skewer

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Kadaj
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Post by Kadaj »

Stop trolling my thread.

I don't give a crap what charge does, if it has at 10 minute timer and it actually works, thats great! I don't want charge to be the bane of crappy link players I want it to be a really usable skill.

If you would stop trolling the thread you would see I offered a few ideas on how charge could change maybe they still are link dependant, but I don't need it to be. I just want it to be worthwhile.
Evilina wrote:Go read the thief threads and see how people feel about extremely high damage skills, the general consensus is they suck.
Go read this thread. Seems the general consensus is that charge needs to be changed because it is stupidly useless.
Heritage
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Post by Heritage »

wtf is trolling? you are supposed to kill those eh? i already added my 50 cents about fixing charge, now git it done son. no refundables.
Chase
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Post by Chase »

Charge is like 4 pulses. Thats a few pulses off a bash timer. If you die on a supposed "crap" link to charge, I can't imagine how you do vs fleestabbers where one pulse gets you killed. Not to mention if you are in that bad of a link that you die to charge/skewer then you obviously will die to a bunch of other skills more often. Plus its not the chargers fault that someone has a poor link.

Lame? Its like a shorter stab timer, with way less dmg but you also don't need notice for it. Also you seem the opponent start it. Nothing really lame there.. If anything I think it helps deter channies who just hit aliases to dmg others without factoring defense. I find it way more boring fighting a thief who seems to think I am suddenly going to stop spamming. They continuously start a stab, you engage, they flee. Rinse and repeat.

I haven't seen anyone play charge or skewer besids Kadaj and there is a reason for that. Its that bad. I tried it in pk and it was worthless.
Evilina
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Post by Evilina »

Chase wrote: I find it way more boring fighting a thief who seems to think I am suddenly going to stop spamming. They continuously start a stab, you engage, they flee. Rinse and repeat.
And fighting a spam charger is different from this how?
Chase wrote: If anything I think it helps deter channies who just hit aliases to dmg others without factoring defense.
Doesn't kick, bash, pstrike, melee dmg already do this?

Kadaj wrote:Stop trolling my thread.

If you would stop trolling the thread you would see I offered a few ideas on how charge could changed
1. Disagreeing with your idea (singular) and pointing out the inbalance is not trolling.

2. You suggested a skill that's timer runs in one room and only gives the opponent one pulse to defend against.

3. You also suggested upping pstrike which has nothing to do with charge/skewer which is what this thread is about.

Why don't you think up and post some constructive ideas on how to change charge/skewer rather than simply demanding it to be upped.
Kadaj
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Post by Kadaj »

Never mind I dont care...
Evilina
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Post by Evilina »

Kadaj wrote:If you think charge is so over powered suggest something to fix it, or dont post.
I never said it was op, I said it specifically kills people with shitty links.
Kadaj wrote:I never said my idea was great or balanced it was just an idea. You've had none
I haven't proposed an idea because you are the one wanting charge/skewer upped and not me, I have simply rejected an inbalanced and bad idea.
Kadaj
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Post by Kadaj »

Lamgwin 2.0

I dunno how many times I can say I would like charge to be useful, not upped.
Kadaj wrote: I just want it to be worthwhile.
Evilina
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Post by Evilina »

Here's an idea since you cant seem to come up with any.

Make charge only usable if the player doesn't have noquit, cap the charge at around 150hps so the skill is used only as a means to engage pk and not used as a flee charge method.

Make the timer 2-3 pulses, and make the lighter lances and spears do higher charge dmg because an abser using an abs lance especially the pike already has top end bash and dmg.
Chase
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Post by Chase »

If they have shitty links they are going to die anyway. No point in arguing over this. Imms made the skill but atm its completely useless. We aren't arguing over if people like it or not, or if it should be in game, but whether it works.
Evilina
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Post by Evilina »

Kadaj wrote:Can these skill's damage be upped to click people consistently?
Kadaj wrote:I dunno how many times I can say I would like charge to be useful, not upped.
So do you want it upped or not upped?
Chase wrote:If they have shitty links they are going to die anyway.
So because someone has a shitty link and more than likely will die we should be given a wiz kill skill?
Chase wrote:We aren't arguing over if people like it or not, or if it should be in game, but whether it works.
Fogel has already stated the skill fills a specific niche so apparently it works, argument settled.
Kadaj
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Post by Kadaj »

Upping damage was in response to nothing being done to charge so the least it could do was actually do damage when it lands on the rare occasion.

I would rather the skill simply work.
Kadaj
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Post by Kadaj »

And that niche is apparently xping and killing afk people. Lets discuss changing that since this is neither an xp mud or lameMUD (well sometimes).
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Fogel
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Post by Fogel »

I will re-evaluate the skill in the near future. However, if I find that the skill works as an effective deterrent to other skills, do not expect it to be changed.
Chase
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Post by Chase »

Evilina really what is so bad on this skill? Saying it kills someone who has a poor link is the same as any other skill. Have you tried it recently?? Obviously not if you continue to try to put it down as a "wizkill" or a huge powerful skill. You should hear Kadaj on narrates. It goes "brick," "brick," "brick." Then when he does finally land its "charged to wounded."

If someone's link is that bad they are going to die to a bash or stab just as quickly. It will prob take 4-5 charges for one to actually land anyway.
Chase
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Post by Chase »

Evilina wrote:Here's an idea since you cant seem to come up with any.

Make charge only usable if the player doesn't have noquit, cap the charge at around 150hps so the skill is used only as a means to engage pk and not used as a flee charge method.

Make the timer 2-3 pulses, and make the lighter lances and spears do higher charge dmg because an abser using an abs lance especially the pike already has top end bash and dmg.
This right here shows that you don't even know what you are talking about. Maybe you are thinking of a year or two ago when charge and skewer were pretty nice. Because I know you haven't faced a charger recently if you are going to throw this stuff out.

So you are going to make it require no no quit and have it only land for 150. So basically it is worthless. First you have to find someone who is going to let you land, which is basically afk or happening to have a timer running. Next lets add the fact that they have to be in a rideable room, so for LS that pretty much removes any place a trolloc would afk. Then if they are running a timer, which means they are probably in pk, you have to be lucky enough to have not been in pk. So basically your idea ruins an already worthless skill to where it just absorbs practices. Next, how many fleechargers have you faced recently? If anything I think you should be concentrated more of fleestab considering it is a huge fad atm in the mud. I dont think Kadaj can fleecharge with himself, and he hardly plays when others are on so he can't coordinate a grand fleecharge campaign against DS. :wink:

Moving on to making lighter lances do more damage. You act like the heavier lances are already great bashers. Have you tried them too? I tried to base my master of one the other day. Even with stances and the extra points on mahogany lance I had no defense and could not touch the 2-3 people I spared against.

I wish you would try to give a good reason why charge and skewer shouldn't be fixed. Right now it just seems because there may be another option to just channeling, bashing, or stabbing. Saying its comparable to a wizkill is ridiculous at best. Its landing rate isnt great plus its damage doesn't do 300+ dmg all the time like you act like it does. Additionally, saying it hurts people with bad links is irrelevant because any skill in the mud has an advantage vs people with bad links. It just seems that you are against charge on principle and not because it is an overpowered skill. The only way I could see charge working in pk atm is vs a linkdead person, and even then you'll prob have to charge him 8-9 times between the bricks and the 2-3 to kill him.

Anyway, I will leave it at this. There is a reason nobody plays charge. Fogel will eventually get around to testing it in pk and he'll see its poorly equiped to stand its worth in pk.
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Lamgwin
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Post by Lamgwin »

Where is Fogel? I haz idea for charge.

P.S: Kadaj you really suck at arguing. You lost to Evilina, lolz.
Evilina
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Post by Evilina »

Chase wrote:This right here shows that you don't even know what you are talking about. Maybe you are thinking of a year or two ago when charge and skewer were pretty nice. Because I know you haven't faced a charger recently if you are going to throw this stuff out.
My idea which I neglected to post included a dramatic increase in the landing rate.
Chase wrote:So you are going to make it require no no quit and have it only land for 150. So basically it is worthless.
A 2 pulse skill that does 150 hp dmg is not worthless
Chase wrote:If anything I think you should be concentrated more of fleestab considering it is a huge fad atm in the mud.
If charge was made op as it once was then it would be the new fad and not timed fleestabbing
Chase wrote:Moving on to making lighter lances do more damage. You act like the heavier lances are already great bashers. Have you tried them too? I tried to base my master of one the other day. Even with stances and the extra points on mahogany lance I had no defense and could not touch the 2-3 people I spared against.
Mahog lance is not a heavy lance, it is a defensive weapon as you well know, I was referring to blackened spear and smithable pike. Pike has nearly the same bash rate as a steel-bound and has more dmg.
Chase wrote:I wish you would try to give a good reason why charge and skewer shouldn't be fixed. Right now it just seems because there may be another option to just channeling, bashing, or stabbing. Saying its comparable to a wizkill is ridiculous at best.
And when your master was based off a mahog and charge was OP you didn't run around clicking people and targetting people with shitty links? I specifically remember when I had a crappy link and you clicked me numerous times because I could not defend against it.
Chase wrote:I wish you would try to give a good reason why charge and skewer shouldn't be fixed.
I have already posted an idea on one way to increase its usability, if you don't like the idea then come up with your own rather than simply saying it sucks so up it.
Evilina
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Post by Evilina »

Lamgwin wrote:P.S: Kadaj you really suck at arguing. You lost to Evilina, lolz.
Actually Lamgwin is telling me what to post word for word.
Edgar
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Post by Edgar »

Lances kind of suck, but charge seems fine to me.

Also, the charging while engaged thing is broken. If that gets fixed I think charge will be pretty good.
Kadaj
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Post by Kadaj »

Ill agree lances suck. Charge while engage was removed because it was "lame" even though you still have to walk into it, which is basically rarely.
Kadaj
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Post by Kadaj »

Although would be better than what it is now...
Edgar
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Post by Edgar »

I meant the thing where you can start a charge while you are engaged. It was really useful when people started fleeing.
Kadaj
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Post by Kadaj »

I know what you meant, but was my understanding someone specifically removed it. But I could be mistaken...
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Lamgwin
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Post by Lamgwin »

Put it back in regardless of if someone intentionally removed it or not.
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Fogel
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Post by Fogel »

Dark steel and mahogany lances were both buffed considerably, hopefully this will help until I get around to revamping lances and spears properly.
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