Vials

[Kathryn]

Plus you now have to wait 3 tics to be able to quaff another vial. A human can go from blight to baerlon and back in half that time.

Tell me there's no problem?

[Lamgwin]

Issuable horses would fix the problem, nothing short of that will do shit for balance.

[Otar]

Until issuable horses is imped the vials should be put back to how they were.

[Lamgwin]

No, vials were stupid before.

[Otar]

Again, human mobility > trolloc mobility. That was before the change. The vial change aggravated a pre-existing mobility balance issue. Until a permanent solution is imped vials should get changed back.

[Lamgwin]

You get a burst of moves, then the rest over 3 tics. If you can't use one of the bajillion darkside patties to get in with current vials, you're horribad.

[Lamgwin]

A single human pker against a single trolloc player may have the mobility edge, unless it's Nicotine, who pops vials like woah. But in group pk trollocs have the advantage. Stop ignoring that. You can't have the advantage both ways.

[Otar]

DS -might- have a mobility advantage in group pk in blight. I refuse to believe that there's not enough horses for a group of ls that's s of blight. Even in the blight, there's a lot of horses.

[Lamgwin]

Trollocs have higher moves regen and higher base moves by quite a bit. And a part of mobility is how easily one can move around, horse hopping isn't viable in chasing/running as a group.

Also, unless a trolloc plays it horribly, I don't see them hag in north pk.

[Otar]

Pukes might have lower regen and lower base moves, but when you add the horse moves and horse regen they've got more in both.

[Lamgwin]

Swapping horses as a group in group pk isn't a viable tactic. It would be impossible to chase any of you fags down.

[Otar]

I don't see why horse hopping groups is impossible, so long as the members are skilled and know zones. As it is, if a puke wants to run, he can run, and run, and run, and run. A troll can run until his moves run out, and then can quaff a vial. The way vials are now they don't do too much. Their effectiveness is severely handicapped by being spread out over a burst and 3 tics. Also, was it impossible to chase us down before the change? No, vials made it harder but it wasn't impossible.

[Guest]

So what i've gathered is because trollocs 'have the advantage' when running away from a group trolloc mvs = human mvs in terms of overall mobility.

Trollocs do not have an advantage when grouped and trying to chase down a human. Most of the time trolls are at good or draining moves (120-170). Humans have this many moves as a base. After their horse hags they should still be able to get into any city at the least, if not hop at the next horseload. Trollocs often hag out while chasing a beat/crit human and can't quaff (no vials) or don't want to because of how expensive they are.

On my ls alt i always end up chasing solo, running on foot to the next horse load and chasing. To be frank, saying a whole group cant swap horses doesn't change anything. Any half decent pker on ls will solo chase a crit/beat troll and move an extra 10 mvs to that next horseload and then continue the chase.

I don't buy groups not being able to horse hop as an argument that impacts on this balance issue.

i really think removing all horse loads outside of a city and upping horses would be a good option to mitigate this problem.

as far as vials are concerned i havn't had the chance to test the new ones, perhaps they are better for trolls than the old ones were *shrugs*.

[Lamgwin]

I don't see why horse hopping groups is impossible, so long as the members are skilled and know zones.

Hrm, 4 or 5 people roll up riding horses, have to dismount and ride 5.6.7.8.9. and 10.horse. Yeah, that's really going to be a quick transition.

As it is, if a puke wants to run, he can run, and run, and run, and run.

How many times do I have to say that I know, and it's a problem with solo humans?

A troll can run until his moves run out, and then can quaff a vial. The way vials are now they don't do too much. Their effectiveness is severely handicapped by being spread out over a burst and 3 tics.

Nearly 30 rooms of burst, with an additional 6 rooms per tic added on to the 22.5 rooms trollocs get while standing regen is severely handicapped?

Also, was it impossible to chase us down before the change? No, vials made it harder but it wasn't impossible.

Who said it was impossible? I said I never really saw anyone other than someone being an idiot go haggard in north pk on a trolloc.

[Otar]

I don't see why horse hopping groups is impossible, so long as the members are skilled and know zones.

Hrm, 4 or 5 people roll up riding horses, have to dismount and ride 5.6.7.8.9. and 10.horse. Yeah, that's really going to be a quick transition.

A troll can run until his moves run out, and then can quaff a vial. The way vials are now they don't do too much. Their effectiveness is severely handicapped by being spread out over a burst and 3 tics.

Nearly 30 rooms of burst, with an additional 6 rooms per tic added on to the 22.5 rooms trollocs get while standing regen is several handicapped?

Also, was it impossible to chase us down before the change? No, vials made it harder but it wasn't impossible.

Who said it was impossible? I said I never really saw anyone other than someone being an idiot go haggard in north pk on a trolloc.

It can be a fast enough transition, so long as the pukes know the zone.

When you compare current vials to old vials, which I did. The current vials are handicapped.

You said it was impossible. You, referring to if the vials were changed back and there was group pk, said 'it would be impossible to chase you fags down'. Was it impossible to chase us down before the change during group pk? No.

[Lamgwin]

Swapping horses as a group in group pk isn't a viable tactic. It would be impossible to chase any of you fags down.

Notice, as a group, in group pk? All having coordinated horse swapping when 10 horses are involved is naive at best.

[Otar]

Use your imagination, I'm sure that if you weren't so obsessed with being right you'd be able to think of how it's possible.

[Lamgwin]

If you notice, I specified remaining as a group. So use your imagination to imagine a way to teach yourself how to comprehend.

[Otar]

Yeah, it's really hard for someone who's horse haggs to grab another horse and rejoin the group. If the group is sitting in one spot, then there's no problem. If the group is moving, then you leave the group anyways. So you grab another horse and rejoin the group

[Lamgwin]

Allowing for the trollocs to get in, like I said....

[Otar]

Uhh... how does even 3 people from a 5 person group switching horses while the others keep chasing let the ds get in?

[Lamgwin]

If you don't dismount and run ahead solo, you just don't have an opportunity to catch trollocs.

[Otar]

So all humans should at all times be able to run down any trolloc?

[Lamgwin]

Keep trying strawman home boi, it might work one of these times.... oh wait.

[Otar]

What exactly is that supposed to mean? Giving up?