KinslayerMUD Forums

Not to step on anyone's toes, but lately this has just become thief mud.

Shield block - Negates bashers approx 75% of the time (in my experience) if used properly
Precise Strike - pretty good damage, breaks defense with no adverse affect to the user (missed bash = lowered defense for a round, missed skewer = lag)
Projectiles - Combined with critical hit do tons of damage in fairly quick time
Daggers in general - high ob, good defense, and combined with attack they deal out the most damage of any weapon. I actually went bash-switch to daggers for attack on an alt and it is scary effective. Lion etched is minimum is 28 dmg if attack is effective. That min is more than all but 3 weapons' max
Bows - not really a thief skill, but I have only seen thieves use. These are pretty good and easy on practices, considering most thieves can have bows and all the stab skills. You don't have to practice any special skills to use power shot, etc.
Dodge - thief max 20 db

I hope this doesn't seem like me complaining since I have almost only played my dreaguard for the past month, but this is just what I have noticed pking with thieves and reading AoW. Thieves are like mini super soldiers now. Compare those skills to a regular warrior or ranger:

Bash
Charge/Skewer - utter waste of practices. who seriously has landed one of these on a person who is in pk?

I guess this is why everyone plays only thieves or channelers now (including me). Because they are both insane. Can something please be done about this? Or give warriors and rangers a cool skill besides 'rescue' or 'bows' which isn't a reasonable option- its like telling a warrior to prac both clubs and axes. They both do the same thing. Bow or weapon bash.. pretty comparable.

Lol I forgot I even forgot Backstab. But yes, that too.

I'm a warrior and fairly new. The only people I've fought have been your dreadguard, one warrior which was what I requested, and three stabbers. And the humans are nearly always stabbers or channelers. I feel all alone as a basher.

I appreciate your post, Chase. I'll do as much as I can to keep things balanced, but Fogel has the final say.

That being said -

Just to be clear, bows no longer have any stunning effect, practiced or not. Power shot is gone.

Projectile land rates have been tweaked and damage done against dodgers has been lowered per my last announcement. If everyone feels it's still too much damage, we can look at it again.

Ah my mistake. I've just seen bow users pull them back especially hard, doing a powerful hit. Not sure what it is.

CHASE FUCKING LAURENT, PEOPLE.

CHASE FUCKING LAURENT.

Point:

A Path through the Forest
The path abruptly turns to the north and east as if it were hastily
constructed. The forest gets thicker and thicker where travel on the path can
only be done in a line. Creatures can be heard shuffling through the trees to
the west and south but no passage seems evident.
[ Exits: n e ]
You see fresh tracks of Phantasm leaving north.
You see fresh tracks of a twisted shadow stallion (ridden) leaving north.
You see almost fresh tracks of Phantasm leaving east.
You see almost fresh tracks of a twisted shadow stallion (ridden) leaving east.
You see almost fresh tracks of a black-and-white Domani razor (ridden) leaving east.
A black-and-white Domani razor is standing here, being ridden by you.

HP:Battered MV:Fresh >
They don't seem to be here.

HP:Battered MV:Fresh >
*Nyoga* has arrived from the north, riding a twisted shadow stallion.

HP:Battered MV:Fresh >
*Nyoga* hacks Malia's feet extremely hard.

HP:Battered MV:Fresh >
`
0
You try to slash *Phantasm*'s hands, but miss.

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>

* - % *Phantasm* tries to pierce your legs, but misses.
Malia tries to pierce *Nyoga*'s arms, but misses.
Malia pierces *Nyoga*'s hands very hard.

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
- Malia avoids being bashed by *Nyoga* who loses his balance and falls!

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>

* As *Phantasm* avoids your bash, you topple over and fall to the ground!

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
*Phantasm* stops using The Backscratcher.

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
*Phantasm* wields a sleek golden bow.

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
*Phantasm* nocks an arrow and begins to study the area.

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
co
cb
Stance changed to: Offensive

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
0
Mood changed to: Brave

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
You try to slash *Phantasm*'s body, but miss.
Malia tries to pierce *Nyoga*'s arms, but misses.
Malia tries to pierce *Nyoga*'s head, but misses.

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
*Phantasm* begins to stare at you intently, a look of concentration spreading across his face!

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>

* - *Phantasm* starts to draw an arrow further back, his muscles rippling powerfully!

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
%
*Phantasm* takes aim and fires an arrow at you from a sleek golden bow!
*Phantasm* nocks an arrow and begins to study the area.

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
*Phantasm* lowers a sleek golden bow.
*Phantasm* nocks an arrow and begins to study the area.

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
- Malia avoids being bashed by *Nyoga* who loses his balance and falls!

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
Malia tries to pierce *Nyoga*'s feet, but misses.

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
sa no wonder
Cancelled...
You say 'no wonder'

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
*Phantasm* begins to stare at you intently, a look of concentration spreading across his face!

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
0
HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>

* An arrow hits you hard.

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
- *Phantasm* starts to draw an arrow further back, his muscles rippling powerfully!

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
% *Phantasm* shifts his aim slightly, studying your body carefully!

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
Malia tries to pierce *Nyoga*'s legs, but misses.
Malia tries to pierce *Nyoga*'s body, but misses.

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
-
* As *Phantasm* avoids your bash, you topple over and fall to the ground!

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>

*Phantasm* takes aim and fires an arrow at you from a sleek golden bow!
*Phantasm* nocks an arrow and begins to study the area.

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
*Phantasm* lowers a sleek golden bow.
*Phantasm* nocks an arrow and begins to study the area.

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
*Nyoga* sends Malia sprawling with a powerful bash!

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
*Phantasm* begins to stare at you intently, a look of concentration spreading across his face!

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
hamstring
HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>

* *Nyoga* hacks Malia's legs into bloody fragments!
*Nyoga* hacks Malia's body extremely hard.

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
An arrow hits you very hard.

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
*Phantasm* starts to draw an arrow further back, his muscles rippling powerfully!

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
-
*Phantasm* takes aim and fires an arrow at you from a sleek golden bow!
*Phantasm* nocks an arrow and begins to study the area.

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
% *Phantasm* lowers a sleek golden bow.
*Phantasm* nocks an arrow and begins to study the area.

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
- *Nyoga* rasps 'about time'

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
*Phantasm* begins to stare at you intently, a look of concentration spreading across his face!

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>

*
*Phantasm* takes aim and fires an arrow at you from a sleek golden bow!

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
*Phantasm* tries to sting your arms, but misses.
You try to slash *Phantasm*'s arms, but miss.
*Nyoga* hacks Malia's head extremely hard.

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
*Phantasm* nocks an arrow and begins to study the area.

HP:Battered MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
An arrow hits you hard.

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
0
HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>

* *Phantasm* begins to stare at you intently, a look of concentration spreading across his face!

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
Malia looks at *Nyoga*.

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
- Malia says 'ouchies nyoga!'

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
*Phantasm* starts to draw an arrow further back, his muscles rippling powerfully!
You dodge to the side, letting an arrow fly past.

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
% Malia tries to pierce *Nyoga*'s hands, but misses.
Malia tries to pierce *Nyoga*'s body, but misses.
*Nyoga* tries to hack Malia's legs, but misses.

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
-
*Phantasm* takes aim and fires an arrow at you from a sleek golden bow!
*Phantasm* nocks an arrow and begins to study the area.

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
*Phantasm* lowers a sleek golden bow.
*Phantasm* nocks an arrow and begins to study the area.

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>

* As *Phantasm* avoids your bash, you topple over and fall to the ground!

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
*Phantasm* begins to stare at you intently, a look of concentration spreading across his face!

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
0
HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>

* An arrow hits you hard.

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
*Phantasm* starts to draw an arrow further back, his muscles rippling powerfully!

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
Malia tries to pierce *Nyoga*'s arms, but misses.
Malia tries to pierce *Nyoga*'s hands, but misses.

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
- Malia avoids being bashed by *Nyoga* who loses his balance and falls!

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
*Phantasm* shifts his aim slightly, studying your body carefully!

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
% -
*Phantasm* takes aim and fires an arrow at you from a sleek golden bow!

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
*Phantasm* nocks an arrow and begins to study the area.

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>

* Your bash at *Phantasm* sends him sprawling!

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Wounded>
You slash *Phantasm*'s legs into bloody fragments!
Malia tries to pierce *Nyoga*'s waist, but misses.

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
sa WTF
An arrow hits you with intense force, spraying blood everywhere!
You wish that your wounds would stop BLEEDING so much!

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
You say 'WTF'

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
Malia avoids being bashed by *Nyoga* who loses his balance and falls!

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
sa DOWN BOWS
You slash *Phantasm*'s body extremely hard.
Malia tries to pierce *Nyoga*'s body, but misses.
Shadows lengthen as the sun dips out of sight in the west.

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
You say 'DOWN BOWS'

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
*Phantasm* growls 'fFk u'

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
*Phantasm* nocks an arrow and begins to study the area.

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
You try to slash *Phantasm*'s feet, but miss.
Malia tries to pierce *Nyoga*'s body, but misses.

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
0
HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>

* *Phantasm* begins to stare at you intently, a look of concentration spreading across his face!

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
*Nyoga* sends Malia sprawling with a powerful bash!

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
- *Phantasm* starts to draw an arrow further back, his muscles rippling powerfully!

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
% - *Nyoga* hacks Malia's hands extremely hard.

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>

*Phantasm* takes aim and fires an arrow at you from a sleek golden bow!
*Phantasm* nocks an arrow and begins to study the area.

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
*Phantasm* lowers a sleek golden bow.
*Phantasm* nocks an arrow and begins to study the area.

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>

* Your bash at *Phantasm* sends him sprawling!

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
An arrow hits you hard.
You wish that your wounds would stop BLEEDING so much!

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
You slash *Phantasm*'s head into bloody fragments!
*Nyoga* hacks Malia's feet extremely hard.
*Nyoga* hacks Malia's body extremely hard.

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
You slash *Phantasm*'s hands extremely hard.
Malia tries to pierce *Nyoga*'s legs, but misses.
Malia tries to pierce *Nyoga*'s shoulders, but misses.

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
0
They already seem stunned!

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
0
*Phantasm* growls 'g \at cy D^ts k'

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>

* *Phantasm* nocks an arrow and begins to study the area.

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
- Malia avoids being bashed by *Nyoga* who loses his balance and falls!

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
*Phantasm* begins to stare at you intently, a look of concentration spreading across his face!

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
Malia says 'ouch attack hurts'

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
% Malia tries to pierce *Nyoga*'s body, but misses.

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
- *Phantasm* starts to draw an arrow further back, his muscles rippling powerfully!

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>

*Phantasm* takes aim and fires an arrow at you from a sleek golden bow!
*Phantasm* nocks an arrow and begins to study the area.

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
*Phantasm* lowers a sleek golden bow.
*Phantasm* nocks an arrow and begins to study the area.

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>

* As *Phantasm* avoids your bash, you topple over and fall to the ground!

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
0
*Phantasm* begins to stare at you intently, a look of concentration spreading across his face!

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>

* An arrow hits you hard.
You wish that your wounds would stop BLEEDING so much!

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
*Phantasm* starts to draw an arrow further back, his muscles rippling powerfully!
Malia tries to pierce *Nyoga*'s body, but misses.
Malia tries to pierce *Nyoga*'s feet, but misses.

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
- Malia avoids being bashed by *Nyoga* who loses his balance and falls!

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
*Phantasm* shifts his aim slightly, studying your body carefully!

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
%
*Phantasm* takes aim and fires an arrow at you from a sleek golden bow!
*Phantasm* nocks an arrow and begins to study the area.

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
*Phantasm* lowers a sleek golden bow.
*Phantasm* nocks an arrow and begins to study the area.

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
- *Nyoga* rasps 'i dont havea ttack damnit'

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>

* Your bash at *Phantasm* sends him sprawling!

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
You slash *Phantasm*'s head extremely hard.
Malia tries to pierce *Nyoga*'s shoulders, but misses.

HP:Beaten MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
An arrow hits you extremely hard.
You wish that your wounds would stop BLEEDING so much!

HP:Critical MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
Malia says 'liar!'
Malia avoids being bashed by *Nyoga* who loses his balance and falls!

HP:Critical MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Battered>
You slash *Phantasm*'s legs extremely hard.
Malia tries to pierce *Nyoga*'s legs, but misses.

HP:Critical MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Beaten>
narr Im out
You narrate, 'Im out'

HP:Critical MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Beaten>
*Nyoga* rasps 'i have an idea. lets all go berserk'

HP:Critical MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Beaten>
cw
Mood changed to: Wimpy

HP:Critical MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Beaten>
cd
Stance changed to: Defensive

HP:Critical MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Beaten>
f
You panic and attempt to flee!

HP:Critical MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Beaten>
e
e
n
e
n
Malia shakes her head.
*Phantasm* nocks an arrow and begins to study the area.
Malia tries to pierce *Nyoga*'s legs, but misses.
Malia tries to pierce *Nyoga*'s legs, but misses.

HP:Critical MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Beaten>
Malia panics, and attempts to flee!

HP:Critical MV:Fresh - Phantasm: Beaten>
Patch of Titan Arums

Master blademaster against a thief with non-master bow. Granted start batt-wounded enter crit to beat, but in hps terms I have more, and he beat what is supposed to be the strongest melee character type in the game (in 1 v 1).

CHASE JUST ADMITTED BLADEMASTERS ARE MORE POWERFUL THAN FADES! AHAAA!

how about instead of downing bows, give warriors/hunters something else to use? I find that just bashing is getting boring!
Another option would be to make bows only very useful against dodge in terms of damage (make abs% absorb a lot more bow damage).

I can stat a super hunter (oh wait I already have one)....

I'll get my uber dodge hunter then and gear him out and prove to you that I can not only do what thieves can, but I can be even more powerful than they are.

Stop blaming this on thieves and try to find the real source of the issue. Its not thieves. Its not abs/bash either.

what stats does your 'super statted' hunter have? O.O

Blademasters are more powerful that fades in 1 v 1, OF COURSE. One is totally 1 v 1 and Fades are group-pk oriented. Don't act like you don't know that. The imms designed them that way

Thieves are now melee characters who happen to have a powerful skill on the side, being backstab.

AND really, this is about non-master thief bows, and thieves in general, not about fades.

Thieves have branched way beyond their supposed skill set. Please, someone look beyond this. They have gone from a specialized skill-set (backstab), to being able to straight up beat a remort basher who is designed to win in 1 v 1 situations. The fact that Phantasm, in the case illustrated, was able to stand in 1 v 1 against a blademaster master is frankly ridiculous, and this is beyond character seperation. This would be the same if I was a Fade, Trolloc master, or a well-equiped abser with a good abs weapon. Thieves should be mainly a non-melee character. If you wanted to make a melee character make a fucking RANGER or WARRIOR.

Thieves are now like a melee character with skill sets to totally negate the other classes. Shield bash negates bash, pstrike, bows, and projectiles negate defense and/or abs. Please seriously look at these two classes.

And really Nyoga, to answer your post, you have no idea what you are saying. I have multiple characters in each class (that nobody knows), and a so called "super-stated" ranger is nothing. How many thieves do you know are 18 20 19 or better? Almost EVERY one, and I consider that super-statted.

A ranger has to be in perfect gear to even compete right now. I have one character I decked out in ok, yet not perfect equipment just to test and he is absolutely destroyed by other characters. Let me know how it goes. Stat this "super statted" ranger (a WoT term), equip him, and pk. I will be waiting on the other side with a thief or a channeler.

My final argument, and I will leave it at this. There is a reason, as I have statted before, why there are almost no bashers right now. The bread and butter of pk is gone. Enjoy thief pk now, but eventually it will fade, as nobody likes constant fleeing and no risk pk. Anyone can use pstrike (and lose nothing but a round of damage, which wouldnt land anyway on a defense character), and pk. It is more skillfull to actually surprise people with stabs, charges, and skewers, and it is more ballsy to hit a patty and bash (knowing you lose a ton of defense if you miss) than using a skill which costs you nothing.

I like how thieves are atm (because they have to sacrifice high rogue pracs for the other skills) but I really wish like skewer/charge was worth practicing, but it only really lands on afk/lagged out people so its kinda a low blow. If someone came up with a cool idea for skewer/more skills for bash type characters it would be pretty sweet.

What about making charge/skewer still have a chance to land even if they engage you, just cut the damage down to like 10-20% of regular if it lands on an already engaged person.

i think that will just lead to people fleeing out and running charges all the time.

I think shorting the charge timer by 1 pulse and allowing people to charge UNENGAGED enemies while engaged would be cool.

that would be a direct counter to thiefs running stabs. Just a thought

Jinn wrote:i think that will just lead to people fleeing out and running charges all the time.

I think shorting the charge timer by 1 pulse and allowing people to charge UNENGAGED enemies while engaged would be cool.

that would be a direct counter to thiefs running stabs. Just a thought

I like it.

Chase hurt my feelings

Haha sorry I wrote that once I was back from bars. I wuv you.

I agree with jinn. it sounds like a good solution.

also making ranger pracs cost 1 more for thieves may help. (maybe, i dont play thieves much so i wouldnt know)

Skewer!!!

The Massive Northern Gates of Fal Dara
Dominated by the large, iron bound gates to the north, this stone courtyard is
used as a marshalling ground for the soldiers of Shienar. The uneven stones
that make up the ground are worn smooth from centuries of use by both man and
beast.
[ Exits: n e s w ]
*Roran* is standing here, riding a black warhorse.
A high-rank Shienaran soldier is standing here.
A high-rank Shienaran soldier is standing here.
A high-rank Shienaran soldier is standing here.
A high-rank Shienaran soldier is standing here.
The gatekeeper is here, watching over the gate.

HP:Wounded SP:Good MV:Draining >
You begin charging towards *Roran*.

HP:Wounded SP:Good MV:Draining >
= + You SKEWER *Roran* right through the middle!

HP:Wounded SP:Good MV:Draining - Roran: Hurt>

skewer and charge and need dmg AMPED like heaps! go out irl and get charged and see how your health is. stab can blick of dmg from 380 to a max of about 445 NON MASTER/REMORT

skewer/charge, as burton just showed, does dmg from healthy to hurt!! thats like maybe 40hps!!! and since they rarely land on people i think they should be able to at least take someone down to bat/beat.

i reccomend skewer/charge dmg get put to 250-320hps dmg

I also like the idea of being able to roll a skewer/charge on an unengaged person WHILE your engaged. that would be awesome. doing 20% of the dmg....


Can some immortal please give us numbers on the current damage of skewer/charge? because right now im just speculating.